red cent Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 He agrees with me on my assertions of a lighter reaction/recoil spring. I have always stated you need enough to cycle the action, strip a round and chamber it and return to battery. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=491378850966888 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. Frank Norfleet Posted May 4, 2014 Share Posted May 4, 2014 I sure thought you would have gotten some argument to this by now. I agree with you. I have started running 12.5 lb springs. Picked up a 1911 that had a heavy spring in it, a lot more felt recoil. Dropped a 12.5 spring in and it is a whole different pistol. JFN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largokc Posted May 4, 2014 Share Posted May 4, 2014 I was thinking about the liter spring & your velocity of the bullet.It seems like with the liter spring it would take less pressure tu operate the slide.So if you have less pressure behind the bullet your velocity would drop off..Largo... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DUSTY BODDAMS Posted May 4, 2014 Share Posted May 4, 2014 largokc, ;D it being a spring and not gas operated I don't think there would be any difference in velocity between no spring and a 22 pound spring. that said I didn't realize that lighter springs were controversial. top shooters have been tailoring the spring to the load for many years , at least back into the late sixties , early seventies. I'm sure it goes further than that. does anyone remember the phrase "powder springs" and not in reference to the MAC 10? that was the old guys shooting lighter than ball and putting in lighter springs to accommodate the reduced load. the 20 and 22 pound springs I think came along because of the plus p rounds and super tight bushings etc. :o also we can't forget the 45 super can we? that would account for a heavy heavy spring. also one more thought ---stock springs in a govt issue was 16 pounds and designed for standard hardball at about 850 fps. to put it one way that would be a 195.5 power factor so if you're loading a 230 bullet at a power factor of 160ish 30 to 35 less it only makes sense to run a less powerful spring than factory. that would be my thought on it anyway. dusty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VICIOUS Posted May 5, 2014 Share Posted May 5, 2014 HI Gang; I use a 13 pound progress recoil spring with a shock buff to protect the frame. so far so good, like the man said as he fell off the 20 story building. I will let you know if there is a crash. Load about 160 PF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red cent Posted May 14, 2014 Author Share Posted May 14, 2014 The 1911 uses a locked system that remains locked until internal pressure decreases. As they unlock, the slide starts to move. The bullet is still in the barrel but will leave before the barrel drops unlocked from the slide. No matter what spring you are using, the spring will not influence the timing of the unlocking of the slide and barrel. You can fire the 1911 without a recoil spring with no damage. I have fired my National Match a number of times sans recoil spring. "Protecting" the slide with a heavier spring is not really..kinda true. The difference in a 12# spring and a 20# spring might be noticed after many, many, thousands of rounds are fired. John Moses Browning, in his writings and in his patent papers called the spring a "reaction spring". The main purpose of the spring is to return the slide to battery. Any other benefits are incidental. The erroneous information on heavy springs goes into the same category as "Shok-Buffs" and full length guide rods. They are not needed. My National Match came with a fl guide rod and I still use it. Don't need it but it works with it. ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largokc Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 Thanks for the reply RED CENT.I didn't know exactly how they worked.The local gunsmith El Mulo Vaquero told me the same thing..I am now more educated...Largo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Dog Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 So is the general consensus that shok buffs are an un-needed gimmick? Then why does Wilson Combat advocate them so highly? Other than the cash register... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 I've known Bill W. since long before he was making pistols and gun parts for a living. It's all about the money. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bodie Tom Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 We know where I stand on those............LOL At least the folks that have given a 1911 for work know when they get their gun back....... LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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