Tully Mars

May be someone else will chime in? However two WB RO instructors, have given the answer. Yes the SHB should reflect it. I suspect the reason it does not, is that the drafters have tried to remove unnecessary items, and this item is just common since. If you shoot Cowboy, what's the call for a hammer back on a revolver? Half notch is mentioned in regards to long guns, only because it was added a few years ago. Again, in the process of staging any gun at the beginning of the stage, if the hammer is cocked (fully back), once that gun leaves the shooters hands, it a SDQ. The pistol is in the holster and not in the shooters hands, it's a SDQ. Tully

You won't find it in the rule book, but nowhere in SASS, Cowboy or WB do we start with the hammer back, other than hammered doubles that are open and empty. Safety notches on long guns are ok in WB, not Cowboy. Yes the rule book should reflect the hammer on the 1911. The rule is same as a long gun with the action closed and hammer back leaving the shooters hands at the beginning of a stage, it's a SDQ. Pistols may be corrected at the loading table, not once a person has left the LT. Regarding cocking the hammer to easy the racking of the slide, that's perfectly legal. Tully

The 1911 is treated just like a revolver in Cowboy. If the hammer is back when the shooter comes to the line, it's a SDQ. One qualifier for long guns is, "in hands", which is seen as the shooter has control of the gun or guns. Once the shooter stages the long guns and removes their hands, the SDQ is applied. The pistol has left the shooters hands once it was holstered and the shooter has left the loading table. It can only be corrected at the loading table. This would be an excellent update for the WB RO course, as it's not cover, or at least to my recollection. Tully

Thanks for the link. That's the Gold Country WB weekend, I'll see want can be arranged. I would like to come, but yes it would be last minute notice. Tully

Hi Last Chance, Do you have a link to the application? Thanks, Tully

We've had DB and TR categories during our monthly WB matches. Folks enjoy it.

Have them go back to slide lock, and correctly go through the unloading procedure, or it's a SDQ. Tully

Most misses are on KD's, Dueling Trees and the like, it gives the newer or middle of the pack shooter more confidence if they hit the target, rather than walk away with a ton of misses. I've been to shoots where the miss count was extremely high, I've heard the grumblings and bitching, I'm just now starting to realize we're doing a disservice to many shooters. Wild Bunch wants to grow, our main source of growth is cowboy. I love cowboy, this is my 21st year of shooting cowboy, but it's changed from the days of far away, small targets. I miss the Chabot days, but folks that win those type of matches put the time in at the range and at home dry firing. Folks that win EOT or Winter Range matches put the time in as well, and will do great no matter the course of fire. BUT the forgotten ones, are more numerous, the ones that only show up for large matches or go to every monthly WB match, but can't practice in between shoots. These are the folks we need to grow and nurture, if that can be done without dumbing down Wild Bunch, I'm all for it. It hurts no one to allow misses on stages that might run a shooter 10-20 misses to be made up. Next time the stage time will be capped at the total of targets, times 5 seconds, shooters going over that total time will all get the set stage time. SDQ's will need to be considered, as it stands a SDQ would equal the same time, and that's not right. Tully

As much as I appreciate the kind words, it's the shooters that make the match. Unfortunately I was distracted and missed some of the best parts of the shoot. Next time around I'll not be a posse leader, just the MD and a shooter, lesson learned. Gold Country Wild Bunch's BoD, worked very hard to come up with unique stages, cook food, and keep folks happy. We have no idea if everyone went away happy, but those that have reached out seem pleased by the shoot! We'll take that as a WIN! GCWB moved away from the rifle only stages of 2021, but that will return, as well more stages allowing make up shots. It's great to watch Silvertip, FJT, Molly Magoo and others burn down a stage without missing, but it was more rewarding watching a shooter turn a 29 second stage shot by one of the top shooters into a 180 second clean stage, and walk away with a great big grin! It's taken me along time to realize how demoralizing 10-20 misses on a stage could be, yet how uplifting that same stage could be to a shooter if we can find away for them to shoot it clean! I've personally fought against moving in this direction, I've always felt that folks should learn their gun, now where it shoots, and not make excuse's for their misses. Well? Maybe I'm getting old or seeing the light? But the smiles of folks that shot those two stages clean, was well worth it! Many would have walked away with double digit misses had they not had the opportunity to correct it. SASS or the ROC may have deferring views of what GCWB is doing, but the above responses say otherwise. The next state WB match I run, the goal will be.....I'll keep that a secret for now :) Tully

Hey Dusty, One third of the main match shooters shot TR, only 4 shot DB, but that number would have increased had I gotten the word out sooner that we had a loaner rifle and ammo available. Tully

This years California State WB match offered a two stage Doughboy and Teddy Roosevelt side match. We weren't sure just how popular it would be, so we kept it to two stages, most shot TR, a handful shot DB. Many folks approached me during the weekend mentioning that they are now looking for a DB rifle. We used a shared bay, with one posse and kept the round count at 5 rifle for each category. The same rifle scenarios were used by both TR and DB. Future matches will have a higher rifle round count, we were concerned about, striper clips and time. So we kept it simple. In time we will increase the round count of both categories. One stage had a Texas Star as the rifle target, the other three 12" hanging Diamonds, both were set at 25 yards. Folks seemed to like it. Tully

It was great shooting and visiting with Red Marie and yourself and all of the other travelers! My only regret is not providing more competition for you, you were on fire! Tully

The 2022 California State Wild Bunch Championship scores: https://cagunslingers.com/Scores/2022/CAWBOverall.html Our numbers were down a little, there were 31 shooters, that hopefully enjoyed themselves. Congratulations to our new state champions! Frederick Jackson Turner..Senior Modern Molly Magoo..Ladies Modern Gopher Broke..Modern Rusty Rose..Ladies Traditional Cordite..Traditional Blackhorse..Senior Traditional Overall: Silvertip and Molly Magoo

The 2022 EOT match offered one stage, that allowed missed targets to be made up, rifle was optional. At the 2022 California State Wild Bunch Championship, we had two stages that allowed for misses to be made up. Folks seemed to love it. Here's Silvertip shooting stage 9, that would have allowed a shooter to make up misses on the DP at the end of the course of fire. There was a designated spotter that would call out the number of rounds needed to make up misses, once the round count for the stage was achieved. The below photo was our second stage that allowed all targets to be engaged until hit or down. Rifle was optional. Thanks, Tully

It's not to late to join in the fun at the 2022 California State Wild Bunch Championship! May 19-22,2022 Tully

FJT, Wow! What an excellent write up and very kind words to go with it! Thank you very much! The 2022 application is available at: https://cagunslingers.com/AnnualMatches/2022CAWB.pdf Come to our beautiful range and shoot WB with us! Tully

GJ, That's a suggestion for the ROC, I'm just relaying the current rules as I understand them. We are in agreement, once anything other than 7 rounds are fired from a magazine, it becomes very confusing to all involved, especially for scoring purposes. Tully

GJ, It's my belief the rule on overloading/illegal ammunition was made to decrease penalties to shooter. In this particular case it becomes a major pain to figure things out, however the last two unfired rounds were legal ammunition that was not fired as part of the round count of the stage. The real issue is the 5 round magazine requirement for this stage. Apparently the shooter had an appropriate and legal 7 round magazine on his belt. It's the 7 seven round magazine that caused the issue. Had all his magazines been 5 rounders, then all his ammo would have been legal and he would not have had problems other than failure to fire issues. I get it that WB is shot with Cowboy at times, in my opinion it's poor practice and creates bad habits. I'm assuming this was a cowboy match that allowed WB as well based on the 5 round magazine. Tully

With the 2022 rules change. it's a penalty for use of the illegal ammunition, no misses. In this case he didn't fire two legal rounds , so 2 misses for the legal ammunition that was unfired in the last magazine. Procedural and 2 misses. Synopsis of 2022 rules changes: https://www.sassnet.com/wildbunch/handbooks/Synopsis%20of%202022%20RULE%20CHANGES%202022-01-09.pdf 6. Overloading Overloading the rifle, shotgun or a pistol magazine will warrant a procedural penalty for any overloaded or illegally acquired ammunition that is shot. However, if a shooter, for whatever reason, shoots more rounds than required by the stage description, no misses will be assessed for the excess ammunition shot. For scoring the stage, it will be considered that overloaded or illegally acquired rounds were not shot. Any targets missed before these extra rounds were fired will still be misses. Tully

That's sad that the powers to be won't work with you.

This will be the first year in awhile I can't make the Arizona State WB match. It's a great match, challenging with a good group of people. Tully

Doc Holloman, Would your club allow a WB match using the existing cowboy steel if yourself or another WB shooter agreed to run it? Is there an open weekend or even after the cowboy matches to have a WB match? Tully

My experience with shooting WB along with cowboy, is nobody wins. WB shooters are disappointed with the scenarios, target distances and round count, many cowboy shooters dislike the 1911 being included simply because it's not a revolver. Shooting 5 rounds in the 1911 will mess folks up at larger WB matches. However if it's the only opportunity to shoot and the club is willing to do it, then I get it. Tully

The synopsis is correct. While preparing to teach a recent WB RO course I double checked many items with the powers that be, this was one of those items. Tully

Most of you have heard the news that Allie Mo passed away after a lengthy battle with cancer. What many of you may not be aware of, is Allie's love of Wild Bunch! Before Allie started having difficulties with her hands she was an avid WB shooter. She would join us at Gold Country Wild Bunch at monthly's as well as several of the California State Championships. She loved shooting the 1911! Allie will be missed, please keep her husband and family in your thoughts and prayers. Tully