Leaderboard

From several thousands of rounds of testing, a 230 grain at 725 fps is faster shot to shot than a 200 grain at 800+. The gun stays down and is less snappy.

New sponsor alert: Winchester Bourbon located in Michigan is now a sponsor for SASS presents Saginaw Showdown 2026 Michigan Wild Bunch State Championship June 13-14th. Applications now available.

Rules written at different times by different persons? Perhaps influenced by their "home range" safety rules that they are familiar with? And perhaps because shot size is hardly important to shooting 10 yard steel knockdown targets. I have seen several WB shooters not be handicapped at all shooting #9 shot. And I shoot #8 all the time. As to exactly WHY in any of the SASS rules, perhaps developed 25 years ago and modified since then, it is almost impossible for most of us to have a real clue. But it's not like we really NEED to know WHY to play the game. Learn the rules, follow the rules - for the game you are playing. But, if you think the two rules need to be "harmonized" (made the same), suggest that to your local Territorial Governor and see if they want to "pick that hill to die on." good luck, GJ

Without any hesitation stage 8. Everyone had the opportunity to shoot blazing fast and still be CLEAN. No need for spotters either the target is down or not. Stage 5 could have been more interesting if the shotgun used all three positions. *Comment* As a PM, fun stages for shooters become stressful stages for TO, spotters and PM. "Fun" for me, happens when the stage has elements to consider.

The 2026 Illinois State WB Championship will be held as part of the 2026 Illinois State SASS Championship match to be held in Milan, IL from July 15 - 19, 2026. Match information and applications can be found here WB is 8 stages, 5 on Wednesday and 3 on Thursday with lunch and awards to follow. Hope to see you there! Cowboy Rick

It's used when there is an appearance of PF failure. At the old WR, it was used every day, every year. Random shooter, one or two per posse, had to submit ammo in ziplocks to be tested. Happened the same way at the older 4 Corners Regionals. Happened, for cause, at a 4 corners regional as well. Shooter had to change ammo. PF was so low it wasn't cycling his 1911.

Because there is none. It's only a penalty if there is a live round in the chamber SDQ If there is an expended in the chamber, and the shotgun is staged closed, it's a P for not cycling the action.

Both pistols are ok. The Queen of Bling uses the SR1911 for both Main Match and a second for backup; WBSHB Pg 18 "Shotgun barrels may have internal choke tubes installed provided they do not extend beyond the muzzle." WBSHB Pg 19 "Front sights may be bead or simple post types. - Mid-barrel sights are allowed and must be the same color as the front sight. - Front sights may be blue, black, steel, ivory, faux ivory, brass, gold, pewter, copper, or silver." No red sights allowed, either optical or stationary, for shotgun.

Who does a function check at matches? https://www.m1911.org/technic25.htm The disconnector test is REALLY critical.

I would recommend your function check after any tuning/repair or every couple of years of use. On a safe outdoor range, load a mag with 1 round, a couple with 2 rounds, and several full mags. When time to test "proper disconnector" function, shoot them in that order. Be ready to control gun with two hands after the first mag. If you have any doubles (or worse), fix it better. There often is no place at a match to do this kind of test. Nor time to conduct it, nor time to fix it. Bring a working gun and working ammo to a Wild Bunch match! good luck, GJ

I have seen safety checks and ammo pulled and some tested. I don't have a problem with that being done...and it probably should be done...along with weighing pistols. I think that really at checkin...pistols should be weighed and the grip safety checked. During the match...random samples of ammo pulled and at least some of it checked.

The disconnector is there for more than that. It prevents it from firing out of battery and from going full auto.

What was really bad was when SASS sold ammo that didn’t meet power factor when it was tested..

No one ever has done official "function checks" in that detail at a WB match. While it may be critical to buying a gun, it's not IMO critical to shooting a match safely. We have a whole bay full of safety officers watching the shooter, and able to stop the action if they see a serious safety problem. The test of a working grip safety and thumb safety has been part of the rules compliance testing of 1911s (along with weight, parts and modifications falling within rules, etc). I was a TO at a major WB match several years ago and issued two Stage DQs on the same stage to a very careless shooter (second one after a Cease Fire had been put in place). Neither was a failure of 1911 function. I think the real safety concern at matches needs to remain "Is the shooter following good safe gun handling". Just like we do now. good luck, GJ

It's in the WBAS SHB, pg 31

The Saginaw Showdown is proud to announce Winchester Bourbon as one of our sponsors for the 2026 Michigan Wild Bunch State Championship. I have personally been to the distillery and sampled both the original and doubled oak. The bottle itself is a great display piece. Bottles can be purchased and shipped directly. Visit www.winchesterbourbon.com for more info. Come shoot with us and try to win some from our prize table. Applications now available.

Get a dr.s note. Exceptions are made.

The short throat in a 1911 barrel catches a lot of new loaders of .45 AUTO by surprise, as they load a few hundred, go to the range, and find every one of the loads fails to go the last 1/8" into battery. Some keys to loading so they will feed well in your gun: 1 - the point on the nose where the upper end of the cylindrical section of the bullet (the shank) STARTS to narrow down (round over) to the nose ogive is the place where the case mouth should be placed during seating. If you crimp down on the shank, the nose will jam into the short throat of the barrel and round will not go fully into chamber. If you crimp out on the ogive of the bullet, you will have collapsed bullets during hard feeding. Remember that there is NO standard nose length on cast .45 AUTO bullets, because there have been hundreds of molds made to cast these slugs over the years. Regardless of what a manual may state. So, don't load to the published OAL, load to put the case mouth at the start of the ogive turn-in. 2 - apply a taper crimp that just returns the case mouth to 0.472", measured with a caliper. You are only straightening out the case from where you expanded the mouth, and just barely catching the surface of the bullet with the inside edge of the case mouth. Looking down from on top of loaded rounds, you should still see a bright ring of brass all the way around the bullet. The case mouth is the headspace location, so if you "bury" the brass case wall all the way into the bullet during crimping, the headspace mechanism is removed and rounds can chamber too deep to fire. 3 - get a loaded round checking gauge, and check EACH cartridge to make sure it chambers perfectly. Several companies make them, including Dillon and Wilson (the trimmer guys, not the gun guys, unless Bill Wilson just happens to be making them now, too). Yes, you can take the barrel out of your 1911 and drop rounds into the chamber, but it will "get old" breaking down your pistol every time you load a batch of ammo. 4 - good on you for bulge busting your "range" cases. But if a round fails the chamber check from step 3, the first thing to try is to bulge-bust that LOADED round. I've busted thousands of loaded rounds and never had a discharge. Second thing to do if you fail chamber-check is to look at the mouth of the case and find any lead finger-nails that "squirted out" during crimping. Depending upon the quality of bullet and your ability to squarely seat a bullet, you may or may not find a sliver of lead needing to be trimmed off the round. Those 2 corrections will almost always get the round to pass chamber-checking. 5 - chrono check and calculate Power Factor yourself. Not every 1911 will shoot a load from the manual at the velocity that the book shows! Sounds like you are well on the way to making great ammo. good luck, GJ

Again, two separate occurrences. 1 Action must be cycled when discarded for the FINAL time. 2. Action not required to be cycled WHEN FOR FURTHER USE.

You guys are a bad influence. I want to shoot classic now. Someone needs to sell me another 73.

Wayne Novak (Novak sights) has made a gold front for at least 10 years.

I fully support....communication and openness!!!!

Thankfully, I’ve never had it happen.

Because it would be real obvious…

Every EOT WB held at Founders Ranch had random rifle and pistol ammo from "random" shooters pulled and tested for meeting the +150 PF level. I know from personal experience as I attended all of those matches. And usually there were weight checks and functioning safeties tested. Some of those I conducted or supervised. Even if no thumb safety application is practiced at any WB match I've been in. good luck, GJ

WBAS Shb Pg 13 says "Thumb and grip safeties must function correctly" However, there is no procedure or requirement to check the safety for function. That would fall under Match Directors Discretion. I remember, years ago, at Winter Range, every shooter had to weigh their pistol, with and without mag, and show the safeties to be functional, on one stage. Haven't seen either of those in a long time.

SE Regional at Memphis Gunslingers had it set up on side match day. Not mandatory, but I had mine done to be sure.

WBAS SHB Pg 21 "All types of athletic shoes or combat boots, no matter the material from which they are constructed. Note: Period military boots with non-grip enhancing soles if appropriate for the costume are legal for Wild Bunch Action Shooting."

nice! samples at the match?

And if you are foolish enough to go down to the 12 1/2# recoil spring, stock up on firing pin springs. You will start breaking them. Remember, if you speed up the slide in opening, you will slow its closing velocity. And vice versa. With a 230 at 725, a 16-17# spring combo is just about perfect.

The benefit to a lighter weight bullet is to get more slide speed at the same power factor. 150 pf is pretty low for 45 Auto. I am going to try some 200 grain bullets this year for that same reason. I have had much better luck with round nose bullets in my 1911s, so if my 200 grain SWCs don't have the reliability I'm hoping for, I will be shooting a true 230 grain round nose bullet, which is historically what I've shot in Wild Bunch. I am going to be backing them down a bit as the ammunition I was shooting last year was loaded to ~170 pf. I had backed it down some from my typical load but I'm going to lighter springs and a significantly lighter load this year and dropping down to a 12.5 pound recoil spring. If you're shooting a stock 1911 with a 23 pound main and 16 pound recoil spring, you're going to want to load to a higher power factor, as the 1911 is designed for 195 power factor ammunition. I recommend the fastest powder you have in inventory, in this case, Titegroup, although many people say not to use it with coated bullets. I have not ever loaded Titegroup in anything so take this advice for what you paid for it. I was using Clays powder last year, I may continue to do that if I have enough left or switch to Clean Shot or WST.

Check us out and add us on http://www.facebook.com/Saginawcowboyshooting

Thanks Joe. I’m hoping to use my Lee combination seat/taper crimp die so I can use my bullet feeder. I’ll futz with it some more this weekend.

My load….. my projectile..4520-.4525” 225-229grn cast, PC’d. two groups of dummy rounds. Both groups plunk and manually feed Group A OAL is 1.168” ; 0.473” case mouth. Looks like maybe too much crimp? or Group B OAL 1.178 case-mouth 0.4755 Thoughts?

Your Ruger should feed either of those bullets with no problem, they both have a nice shape to them. Good magazines are a must for any 1911, the Ruger factory ones are good, MecGars, Wilson's [the best but expensive] . KimPro mags are good but avoid the basic Kimber ones.

Thanks Joe, this is great info!

It seems to me that, apart from deliberately choosing to wear a hair shirt, or perhaps as an exercise in willy-waving, if there is no reward/penalty for shooting Classic v. Modern, that Classic shooters are needlessly handicapping themselves with the use of larger bore rifles. I know that I am faster with a .38 than a .45 rifle. While that may be just me, in the consideration for the overall finish, I will have to consider that, moving forward. Great match, and a lot of fun! Cheers, FJT

But no one wants to shoot that. I mean, after a year of planning to shoot sub caliber guns and having the classic rules announced less than two months before, still a third more shot Classic. Maybe that’s what people want…

I've got pink on the front and lime green on the rear. 😄

There is no penalty for "overloading" any long gun. The penalty occurs when something is done with the "overloaded" rounds, i.e. Shot downrange (P), used to complete a sequence after ejecting a round (P+M), left in chamber of gun, action open or closed (SDQ) Other penalties are: Expended round left in chamber and action NOT cycled (MSV) The only Possible penalty for loading 4 when the instructions called for 2 is 1: P for not following stage instructions 2: Get someone who knows the rules to write the stages.

WBSHB Pg 14 "Sights may not be optical or fiber optic. Laser sights are not allowed. Sights may be painted or have colored dots or inserts." No restriction on colors for 1911 sights in Modern.

Not an orange fiber optic sight that "glows" in sunlight. But, sights can be painted or a colored insert or dot (non-fiber) can be applied. The rule: But of course, different rules for Traditional guns: good luck, GJ

My favorite is a 1/8” gold bead. I’m not sure who is producing them at the moment. I’m working on it but the price of labor and gold…

Folks, I just finished a new batch of firing pins. I have plenty available. Along with new hammer springs. If you have ordered any from me recently, they are already on the way or will be Monday. Thanks!

The question should be, Why didn't the old regime start an Open category like requested? The whole issue whould have been avoided.

For years, a lot of us offered ideas. They were shot down by people who never shot Wild Bunch and had not then, and still have, no clue. I will not stop criticizing the current status because when adults ran the organization it grew. Now, not so much… If it were growing as some claim, why were the “Classic” categories created?

That looks like a Novak sight cut. As long as there is no optic mounted, Novak sights are legal in Modern. Obviously, it can’t have a fiber optic either.

Now if they colored the brass, say purple, when they had small primers - that would be fine 🙂

I am officially retired from Wild Buch management BUT I can tell you for the first 10 years of real Wild Bunch this question of "Shooters Choice " never was even thought about or considered. If you had a failure to fire the 1911 for any reason, you just cleared the gun, put in another magazine and continued where you were. Everyone shooting would do as Eyesa asked. Fix the gun and proceed to avoid penalties and hopefully misses. Aparently those days are past. Very sad in my opinion.

That would make it a clean stage, yep. Drop mag at end and rack to slide stop to make sure the 1911 is open and empty. GJ