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Power factor for pistol is, and always was, 150. Power factor for Wild Bunch Rifle is 60 Power factor for Classic Wild Bunch Rifle is 150 The PF for Pistols was never changed. If a club decides to no longer offer WB because of the 150 PF for Classic Rifle, they need to acknowledge the PF for ALL Pistols, forever, has been 150. Nothing new here. Figure some other reason to not allow WB.

Mine get edited when I spot a typo after posting it, or I want to comment on another point, like I did about the question of how the OP's ammo looked. None were edited after another poster added their reply. GJ

Don’t drop the loaded round into the chamber and drop the slide. You will certainly at some point break the extractor. It’s designed for the cartridge rim to ride up the breach face under the extractor hook.

One bay. 2 volunteers. In between 2 stages somewhere in the match.

There was a bay where the equipment was set up for anyone to test their loads. That was the day before WB started. Some folks took advantage of the opportunity, some didn't. It's impractical to check 150+ shooters ammo, at five rounds each, and still complete the match. There is no more MDQ for scoring purposes so, once challenged and found lacking, it's a SDQ for any stage, after that, the ammo is used, and a MDQ for the second stage used.

I wonder why we care if the safeties work if we're not allowed to move with loaded guns or have loaded guns in our holsters. Would you really want to win a Wild Bunch match because your fellow competitor's grip safety didn't work when tested?

Doing it like that seems tremendously unfair and to send the wrong message. If it can't be done with calibrated equipment and for everyone, it shouldn't be done at all.

I cleaned & lubed, and polished the feed ramp of my Taurus PT1911 and loaded up another 24 rounds with an added 1/4 turn of crimp and I had zero problems! 3.7 grns of TiteGroup under my Home cast/PC’d MP mould 227gr RNFP NLG .452 sized bullets with WRE LP primers. 740fps, 168PF, STD Dev 11.4 MAXXTECH 230grn FMJ 769fps, 176PF, std dev 25.0 I’ll take the Ruger SR1911 out next time now that the FEDEX guy showed up…. (Note I ordered 2! 🤪)

And I actually prefer Small Primers in my .45 acp...don't have to re-set my Dillon 550 after a 9mm or .38 spl. run Bugler

Not arguing with you. I am just stating what I have observed in the past and cautioning about driving clubs and people away. I am glad that Misty saw the wisdom in making changes to bring in more shooters. I have spent time talking with shooters and encouraging them to come back and give WB another try. The old regime did their best to alienate shooters that had been shooting WB for years before they took over and changed the rules to suit them and their needs. Please try to understand that it is the disaffected CAS shooters that will grow the ranks of WB shooters. I believe in what Misty and CC are doing so strongly that I became certified to teach WB. I want this game to thrive, but harping on how the new game is not good is not the way to help anyone.

That is not a rib, it's a sight base. That older style of adjustable sight needs a long slot to mount the front part of the sight. Besides, factory (OEM) full ribs have been allowed if they are part of the manufacturing process, not an add-on. Like on some Gold Cups. good luck, GJ

Bring all rifle power factor back to 150

You ever wonder why you were never asked to “help write the rules”? You ever notice that you have to edit 95% of your posts because they’re wrong to begin with?

Tall John, You will notice that some posts are all edited because they are originally wrong and googled based, not experience and success based.

A new 1911 has traditionally needed about 200 factory power FMJ rounds through it to break it in. Loosen up the action, wear in the extractor, etc. The Taurus? Would not HURT to run some through it, too. Fire 50 or so, clean the gun. Repeat. Look for any failures of any sort. If a 1911 is hiccuping on factory FMJ, it for sure has problems that can get in the way of running lighter power lead bullet ammo. Report back how the break ins go. There COULD be a function problem with both guns, but very unlikely. Unlikely either will malfunction with FMJ, but the object is to loosen the gun up so testing with lighter lead bullet ammo tells no lies. So, loosen the guns up before you seriously start looking for why the reloaded ammo does not run the guns well. The ammo you have loaded at this point looks reasonable. Nose is a little flat-ish compared to FMJ ammo. That should not cause a failure to feed the last 1/8" into chamber though. Powder coating CAN cause some chambering problems. Have the bullets been run through a sizer die AFTER being powder coated? I have seen some coatings so thick or so non-slick that they cause a failure to feed, but mostly by sticking the nose to the feed ramp and depositing powder coat color there. good luck, GJ

Layered safety, I would guess. Just like in aviation, where a mistake in operation or mechanical failure can be fatal. But, I did not help write the rules. I just shoot by them. good luck, GJ

Gun is not in battery (ready to drop hammer on firing pin) until the rear surface of slide and rear surface of frame just below the joint between them are perfectly flush. This is not a jam, or a failure to feed. It's a failure to go into battery. If you push the slide forward with a strong tap of heel of your off-hand, does this resolve the failure-to-fully-chamber problem and let it fire? If it does, do you keep the disconnector tip lubed with a drop of oil every time you take gun apart for cleaning? Are you using range pickup brass to reload? If so, you really need a chamber check gauge to see if your brass has a base bulge common with loads that are hot enough to swell the case just in front of the extractor groove. Barrel plunking probably will not find these bulged brass situations. Spend $20 or so and get a good loaded round checker gauge! The most common problem new .45 auto loaders have is they run into brass with bulges at the base, which the sizer die in .45 auto will not remove! That is where the Lee bulge-buster kit comes in really handy. This consists of a push-thru die and a push rod which install on a spare single-stage press. Even a loaded round can be pushed through this die safely. But the best way to use it is "bulge bust" all fired brass that you know you did not shoot from your own guns, before you reload it. If you sometimes shoot almost +P level reload ammo, you may want to bust all your own fired brass, too. The bulge if not removed, sometimes means the round will not fully chamber, thus will not fire. Second cause of failure "just short of fully chambered" is a bullet seated long enough to jam the ogive of the nose into the very short throat of the 1911. If you find the rounds that do not chamber and inspect the exposed bullet nose for rifling marks, it should tell you if that round was over-length for your gun. No part of the cylindrical SHANK of the bullet should be in front of the case mouth. Only the rounded ogive of the nose can hang out in front of the mouth. good luck, GJ

Great idea. Get a bay, that's not being used, turn it into check bay. Shooters come off the previous bay, check in at test bay, weigh, check safeties, do PF test, move on. I like it. Now, to get the Powers That Be, involved. Thanks for the ideas.

All USPSA matches are tested and there are several hundred shooters. For example, testing is on stage 4. As shooters finish stage 3, they go test. It’s recorded. They go to stage 5. Match officials check PF for major and minor levels and if a shooter doesn’t meet, they face consequences. Shooter gets to the test area, official asks for a magazine off the body and tests. May be first mag maybe third mag. I prefer knockdowns that require a certain level of PF. Yes, it’s hard to keep them calibrated. Yes, it’s a lot of work for a match staff.

How many bays? How many volunteers? When do they test? Want to volunteer to help, or just bitch

What was really bad was when SASS sold ammo that didn’t meet power factor when it was tested..

The short throat in a 1911 barrel catches a lot of new loaders of .45 AUTO by surprise, as they load a few hundred, go to the range, and find every one of the loads fails to go the last 1/8" into battery. Some keys to loading so they will feed well in your gun: 1 - the point on the nose where the upper end of the cylindrical section of the bullet (the shank) STARTS to narrow down (round over) to the nose ogive is the place where the case mouth should be placed during seating. If you crimp down on the shank, the nose will jam into the short throat of the barrel and round will not go fully into chamber. If you crimp out on the ogive of the bullet, you will have collapsed bullets during hard feeding. Remember that there is NO standard nose length on cast .45 AUTO bullets, because there have been hundreds of molds made to cast these slugs over the years. Regardless of what a manual may state. So, don't load to the published OAL, load to put the case mouth at the start of the ogive turn-in. 2 - apply a taper crimp that just returns the case mouth to 0.472", measured with a caliper. You are only straightening out the case from where you expanded the mouth, and just barely catching the surface of the bullet with the inside edge of the case mouth. Looking down from on top of loaded rounds, you should still see a bright ring of brass all the way around the bullet. The case mouth is the headspace location, so if you "bury" the brass case wall all the way into the bullet during crimping, the headspace mechanism is removed and rounds can chamber too deep to fire. 3 - get a loaded round checking gauge, and check EACH cartridge to make sure it chambers perfectly. Several companies make them, including Dillon and Wilson (the trimmer guys, not the gun guys, unless Bill Wilson just happens to be making them now, too). Yes, you can take the barrel out of your 1911 and drop rounds into the chamber, but it will "get old" breaking down your pistol every time you load a batch of ammo. 4 - good on you for bulge busting your "range" cases. But if a round fails the chamber check from step 3, the first thing to try is to bulge-bust that LOADED round. I've busted thousands of loaded rounds and never had a discharge. Second thing to do if you fail chamber-check is to look at the mouth of the case and find any lead finger-nails that "squirted out" during crimping. Depending upon the quality of bullet and your ability to squarely seat a bullet, you may or may not find a sliver of lead needing to be trimmed off the round. Those 2 corrections will almost always get the round to pass chamber-checking. 5 - chrono check and calculate Power Factor yourself. Not every 1911 will shoot a load from the manual at the velocity that the book shows! Sounds like you are well on the way to making great ammo. good luck, GJ

Ok Monday morning, time to kick this horse. Boy y’all are making this way harder then it needs to be, or I’m dumber then my wife say’s I am. I’m not wanting/trying to stir anything up. But I have problems/issue’s with some interpretation’s/comments and just want to be able to make the correct call, and have proof in what is written in the book. As we all know a SxS shotgun does have an action, and therefore can be cycled.. It’s called a Break action or Break-open action. Heck all firearms have an action and must be cycled, if you ever want to shoot another round. The way I’m reading this post, it started out about the penalty for an empty left in the SxS gun. Then it appears to have moved to whether you can cycle the action on a SxS. We can all agree that the SHB state’s, “There is no penalty for an empty case/hull in a gun that is open or that the shooter has cycled. If a proper attempt has been made to cycle the gun. It will be cocked.” From reading the above statement, there is no penalty for an empty hull left in a shotgun. If it is open or been cycled. It’s an either OR scenario, not an And scenario. So did shooter open the SxS? If yes, no call. Was the gun cycled? If the SxS is open, it had to have been cycled, if the hammers were cocked. So another yes. No penalty for empty hull in a SxS. In the definition for “Action Cycled” where does it state “it only applies to lever and pump action long guns”? Just because that phrase is in parentheses does not make it absolute. The definition of the phrase Action Cycled is “opening the action far enough to cock the hammer” is a lot more absolute. So, the way I read it, a SxS can have it’s action cycled. So onto the last issue. Since some folks have stated that the SxS cannot have the action cycled. Either due to interpretation of the glossary or that SxS do not have an action. Anytime an individual uses a SxS in WB, will they be awarded a MSV each stage? As they cannot cycle the action of a long gun, either do to not having an action or by use of the glossary? It’s the first bullet in the MSV list in the SHB. Also FYI on the comment “addition of “lever and pump action long guns” in the definition of Action Cycled” makes it a no go”. The term’s Action Closed/Open were added in the June 2014 v 7.0 SHB. There was no Action Cycled at this time. In January 2019 v12.2 SHB is when the Action Cycled, with the current verbiage was added. But since the initial addition in 2014 these terms have always had the “(lever and pump action long guns)” after the term. Unless something officially is published for this scenario, if I’m TO’ing and a empty hull is left in an open SxS (as long as you cycle the action). You will get a no call from me. Benefit of doubt to the shooter. And there sure is a lot of doubt/misconceptions in this post. Y’all have a great day. Got my flame suit on

Joe, Chased all those rabbits and then some more. My statement still stands. JFN

Griff, At the risk of "justifying their existence" I will answer your question. The main reason I like SP brass is it is much easier to load, specifically to prime than LP brass. I seem to have zero problems with high primers and primers that are difficult to seat. Second, I find that SP loads are more consistent in velocity, a narrower spread from high to low. Third, I can buy once fired SP brass way cheaper. Fourth, SP brass has a heavier web. When you cut one in half, the web and sidewall at the base are thicker like a 45 GAP or a Starline +P. Which should make it stronger in unsupported areas. LP brass runs 78-79 pieces a pound while SP brass runs 72 pieces a pound. As a side note, I have found that my 45 ACP '73 rifle needs nearly new LP brass to run well and fire every time. But, use any SP brass and problems go a way. I have a 5 gallon bucket full (5000+ pieces) that is half way through its 10th reload. I try not to take it to the local matches unless I am out of LP loads. That is my practice brass. If I have to use it (like last month) I warn every one to check their brass carefully, because I know a lot of shooters don't like it. JFN

AW & GJ sorry for the misunderstanding. I posted the above for information only. Since I shoot primarily small primer brass, I have been asked if there is a difference in velocity. While I felt that small primer brass lowered the velocity, I had never compared them side by side. My only fallacy in the test is that the primers are not all from the same manufacturer; as, I am now wondering if all Winchester primers are "hotter." So let me be clear. I don't feel the need nor compunction to justify a superior brass to you or anyone else. :) JFN

I thought that the Winchester SPM primers felt better, but figured it was a head thing. WOW I aint losing it.

None of this is new. Implementation is not encouraged, it seems, currently.

A few years back, this year's EoT Overall WB winner, German shooter HellHound, was DQd, after the factory ammo that he bought here in the states was found to be just under PF. Sigh. FJT