Tully Mars Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 Are all dies created equal? I know case gages vary, my Lyman is of a tighter tolerance than my Dillon. Here's the issue, my current load using a 650 and Dillon dies has worked for years in my three WB pistols without any issues. Recently I bought a Springfield TRP and my current load will have failures to feed. For example, 2 FTF in 5 magazines, it's the last 1/16" to 1/8" of an inch. By changing my Dillon crimp die to the Lee Factory crimp with the carbide insert, I was able to reduce the FTF to 2 out of 100 rounds. Pretty sure if I ran my current loads through the Lee bulge buster they would all feed reliably. I want to avoid this if possible. The Lee dies produce a round that is .469-.470 from the case mouth to the top 1/4" of the case. The Dillon is .471-.472", there's a .003" variance. At this time I believe the chamber to be a tighter tolerance than my other guns, I don't think it's an OAL issue (1.235" with a 230 RN SNS). Can I purchase dies other than Lee that will give me a tighter tolerance? I really don't wish to use the Lee dies on the Dillon. I haven't tried a heavier recoil spring as of yet, it might make the difference, I it's a 16lbs spring. Either way the recoil spring is not the main issue. Thanks, Tully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 I would try crimping just a wee tiny bit more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 27, 2019 Author Share Posted October 27, 2019 I would try crimping just a wee tiny bit more. The current set up with the Lee die is giving more crimp, it's also resizing the top 1/4" of the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 In my opinion you need to just readjust the Dillon crimping die a bit. I am NOT a fan of the Lee crimp die. If you get too much crimp the round will not be headspacing on the case mouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 I would try crimping just a wee tiny bit more. The current set up with the Lee die is giving more crimp, it's also resizing the top 1/4" of the case. I had some ammo not going in all the way and thought it was not sizing the bottom of the case and come to find out I was not crimping enough. Once I crimped the right amount the ammo just dropped right in. Not saying that this is absolutely your problem just suggesting something real simple to try. It may be that simple, it was for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 Let me also say that I get maybe 2-4 out of 1000 that don't drop in the case gauge. I am thinking they may have been shot in a Glock or something. But if they go in my case gauge they work in my Springfields. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 27, 2019 Author Share Posted October 27, 2019 Everything case gages well with my current load. I'll try adding more crimp with the Dillon die and see what happens. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 28, 2019 Author Share Posted October 28, 2019 Flash and Happy Jack, I've adjusted the Dillon crimp die, loaded 150 rounds and cased gaged them. I'll try them Tuesday. Thanks for the suggestions. Tully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 I have a very tight chambered 1911 in 9mm for IPSC (Beautifully made by Boggus Deal BTW..) I use the EGW undersized sizing die for that and it works brilliantly. Those dies are .003" "tighter" than standard....and are available in 45 acp. (They are in fact made BY Lee!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 Failing to chamber by 1/8" is usually one of two problems: The very bottom of the case just above extractor groove is swollen by a high pressure load or firing in a chamber that does not fully support the round (like some Glock, some sub guns). OR The bullet is jamming into the throat. I'll bet you have the second possibility under control. So, it's probably the first. And, yes, using the Lee Bulge Buster solves a large base (or rim, too), by sizing the complete case, not just the upper 80%. Yes, it also reduces the diameter of the case. But if one "bulge busts" before sizing and expanding, you get the mouth back to correct diameter. I find the bulge buster technique to be a quick and very effective way to make sure I get 100% feeding on my .45 auto loads. I set the bulge buster die (a Lee factory crimp die with the crimp cylinder and screw removed) up in a single stage press that I never put away. There are some expensive "roll sizing" rotary sizers that run rollers over the entire case to get it sized with the designed slight taper. If you want fast, that approach is what a lot of commercial loaders use. Good luck, GJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 GJ, You and I are thinking alike on this, however I'm going to try the adjusted crimp first. It's frustrating since this has been a reliable load for years, until the new gun. Thanks, Tully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August West Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 Since no one has mention this..... Springfield 1911s are noted to have short (zero) freebore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 Hi August West, Are you suggesting trying a shorter OAL due to the "zero tolerance freebore", that was my first consideration. But changed when I used the Lee crimp die which improved my FTF dramatically and got me thinking about chamber tolerance. I should have mentioned that all my 1911's are Springfield's. One has a match barrel and bushing installed by WTB the others are standard barrels. I'll load some shorter and take them with me tomorrow to the range. What makes this so irritating is that that the range is an hour and a half away. Thanks, Tully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 I am concerned that the LFC die is making the case mouth too small and probably crimping it enough that the round is seating too far in the chamber. This is a guaranteed way to break an extractor. I would try a slightly shorter OAL (seating the bullet shoulder in the case a few thousands further). AW's comment about no freebore is probably right in this instance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 Happy Jack, We're in agreement on the LFC, it's not what I want to use and yes it increases the OAL. I've loaded 150 with the adjusted Dillon crimp. I'll do another 150 with a change in the OAL. Hopefully one of these adjustments will take care of it. In addition I'll run 100 of my current loads through the bulge buster just to see what happens. My big concern is getting the TRP to run reliably, without losing reliability in the three other guns. If the bulge buster works 100% of the time, I'd consider leaving my load alone and running the TRP rounds through the bulge buster. Tully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 A wild and crazy operator might take that TRP barrel, cerrosafe cast it to get actual internal diameter measurements on chamber, and have it re-reamed (or even honed, which would be simpler) to enlarge the chamber to get closer to factory minimum specs.... That way the crazy operator would have a piece that did not need special attention to the loads it needed to function at 100%. And perhaps not be so crazy after all..... Gotta keep the big picture in mind. Perfect Function "uber alles." Good luck, GJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 I have a very tight chambered 1911 in 9mm for IPSC (Beautifully made by Boggus Deal BTW..) I use the EGW undersized sizing die for that and it works brilliantly. Those dies are .003" "tighter" than standard....and are available in 45 acp. (They are in fact made BY Lee!) Tropper, I'll keep this information in mind. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 A wild and crazy operator might take that TRP barrel, cerrosafe cast it to get actual internal diameter measurements on chamber, and have it re-reamed (or even honed, which would be simpler) to enlarge the chamber to get closer to factory minimum specs.... That way the crazy operator would have a piece that did not need special attention to the loads it needed to function at 100%. And perhaps not be so crazy after all..... Gotta keep the big picture in mind. Perfect Function "uber alles." Good luck, GJ GJ, Above all else I would like to make this work without reaming or honing. However a cast of the chamber might answer some questions. Hopefully tomorrow will work, if not I'll order some cerrosafe. At this point I still think reloading adjustments will take care of it. The bulge buster works, but isn't really what I want to resort to. Thanks, Tully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 Any 1911 I have in 45ACP that I can come up with an excuse to re-barrel has a KART barrel. They are the best kept secret in precision ACP shooting. I don't think you will need to work on the barrel you have, just check your loads. What works in the Springfield will be fine in your other pistols. I shoot using 4 different 1911's and after problems over the years I finally resorted to running all fired brass through a bulge buster. Solves 99% of all ammo problems. (you can also run fired rounds through one if necessary but I don't do it unless absolutely necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 30, 2019 Author Share Posted October 30, 2019 Thanks to everyone who has responded. Using a shorter OAL of 1.25" and an increased crimp, didn't change a thing. However increasing my recoil spring from 15 to 18lbs, resulted in the gun clambering all the rounds loaded into it. I don't think it's OAL, crimp or freebore. Factory ammo shoots and chambers fine. I think the chamber is tighter than my other pistols. At this point I believe honing the chamber as Garrison Joe mentioned is the ticket if I wish to go to a lighter recoil spring, otherwise I'll use the 18lbs mainspring and in time the chamber wear on the tight spots. At least that's my thoughts for now ;) Thanks, Tully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvertip Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Hi Tully I hate to see you struggle I’ll give you 20 bucks for it ST Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tully Mars Posted October 31, 2019 Author Share Posted October 31, 2019 Hey Silvertip, I will take that under consideration. I think I'm on the right track at this point. The barrel is going out for some honing, hopefully that fixes things. Otherwise it's working with more recoil spring. Thanks for the offer! Tully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvertip Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 Glad you got it figured out I had a tight chamber in one years ago and I never saw a benefit of it , just the hassle. ST Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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