What's the call?

[Totes Magoats]

Scenario is irrelevant.  Watch the pistol when the rifle is discarded.

 

WTC?

 

[Cayuse Jack]

Broke the 170, SDQ

 

Hard to see at the start, what about the finger on the trigger while racking the slide?

[Old Man Graybeard]

I couldn't tell if the finger was in the trigger guard at the start or along side the frame...as at the second position. I shoot traditional...and sometimes get yelled at for finger...but what I am doing is hitting the mag release

[Eyesa]

I couldn't discern the trigger finger. But agree with SDQ for breaking the 170 with the pistol. What was the actual call?

[Flying W Ramrod]

4 hours ago, Cayuse Jack said:

Broke the 170, SDQ

 

Hard to see at the start, what about the finger on the trigger while racking the slide?

There is no rule about keeping the trigger finger off the trigger when initially charging the pistol. The only finger rule is; when changing mags, moving, correcting malfunctions.

WBAS SHB Pg 14 "When handling the 1911, the shooter’s trigger finger must be outside the trigger guard when moving, reloading, or clearing a malfunction after the pistol is first charged."

No call on the trigger finger.

SDQ on the 1911 after the rifle smacked it, though.

[Totes Magoats]

MSV was called. There was discussion on how the pistol got into the position.  Should be SDQ. 
 

As for the finger at the start. I had it pinned to the top front side of the trigger guard where it meets the frame. 
 

Totes

[Burt the Undertaker]

The pistol flipped over (didn't rotate) and it doesn't look like it's breaking the 170°. It's close but I personally don't think it is....

[Garrison Joe]

You have to be on the firing line to determine "breaking the 170."  Looking at a video is NOT the way to judge it.  I'll trust the eye witnesses who were right there.  good luck, GJ

[El Chapo]

14 hours ago, Totes Magoats said:

MSV was called. There was discussion on how the pistol got into the position.  Should be SDQ. 

 

What was the basis for that call?

[marshal stone]

Pistol was initially restaged properly but was hit by the rifle when it was discarded

changing it resting place. Hard to tell from the video if it broke the 170. Those with

eyes on the pistol should make the call. As the shooter stated where's the protractor

to determine if the 170 was broken.

Marshal Stone

[wyliefox]

Hijack---

There maybe a discussion here.  Hit-Miss?  Benefit-of-the-doubt does and should go to the shooter. 

What about safety issues?  IMHO, what the shooter did was NOT safe.  

I was unable to hear if the TO made a call regarding the pistol.  It appears the shooter grabbed the pistol preventing further discussion.  Making a joke of the issue.  Which is a problem.  Potentially Spirit of the Game.

Assuming the 170 was determined to be a "no call", SDQ for unsafe gun handling.

 

[Eyesa]

It looks it didn't break 180 but awful damn close, maybe 175! It was blocked and recovered too quick to be positive and doubtful spotters would have seen it. RO would have to make the call and it appears that benefit of doubt went to the shooter.

Edited 20 hours ago by Eyesa

[wyliefox]

31 minutes ago, Eyesa said:

it appears that benefit of doubt went to the shooter

That is my point, should safety issues be considered of higher importance than "if you think it is a miss then it is a hit"

[Garrison Joe]

It's the RO's job to call any penalties, like a SDQ.

It's the spotters' job to call hits and misses.  They can point out a POSSIBLE penalty, but RO has to call it.  Unless it's a situation where an immediate Cease Fire needs to be called, like a person down range.

[Eyesa]

1 hour ago, wyliefox said:

That is my point, should safety issues be considered of higher importance than "if you think it is a miss then it is a hit"

Yes

[El Chapo]

1 hour ago, wyliefox said:

That is my point, should safety issues be considered of higher importance than "if you think it is a miss then it is a hit"

What's the safety issue?  If it left his hand loaded it's a SDQ anyway.  Are we really that worried about an empty gun?

[wyliefox]

35 minutes ago, El Chapo said:

Are we really that worried about an empty gun?

OK, using that logic, why use any time at all to make sure it is CLEAR, at the end of the stage?

[El Chapo]

13 hours ago, wyliefox said:

OK, using that logic, why use any time at all to make sure it is CLEAR, at the end of the stage?

If it was up to me, we'd run a hot range all the time and that wouldn't make me uncomfortable at all.  

Rules are rules, and if there was a violation of the rules, a penalty should apply.  But pretending like we are doing anything to increase safety by dinging the guy for what we saw here isn't adding anything.