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That is BS too, although I didn't realize either of those were impermissible. Although I don't agree, I will continue to play the game no matter how they make the rules, but the rationale for many of them is lost on me.

Can’t make up rifle or pistol…

I find it very strange that people are so opposed to shotgun makeups. I just don't get it.

Wild Bunch Action Shooting Participation and Voting Data: 88 Territorial Governors 85 Votes – 96.5% Response Rate Voting Item Should WBAS allow Shotgun Make-ups? RESULTS NO. Leave it as is. A Shotgun Miss is a Miss. – 61 (71.7%) YES. Allow Shotgun makeups in WBAS. - 24 (28.2%) NO CHANGE

I saw on the CAS forum that someone posted the results of the CAS TG vote, does anyone know the results of the WBAS TG vote?

Bear Creek has been running both of these as main match categories for 3 years now, and have strong competition in both. These two are easily the most fun categories, if nothing else just because they are something different and a different kind of fun.

Couple of possibilities; Is the new tube perfectly round? If not you'll have problems Not sure if the Model 12 and a model 97 use the same tube. Someone may have sold you one for a Chinese clone. They look identical but the threads are different so they are not interchangeable.

If it doesn't fit dry, it isn't going to fit greased. Send that garbage back and follow the instructions of the people above, who told you what tools you'll need to repair your existing magazine tube.

I purchased a new magazine tube instead of repairing the old one. It is new production. I am having trouble getting it to fit the threads of the receiver. Do you guys use any kind of grease?

Send it to a Smith that has some experience. Dent removal has a bit of a learning curve and if things don't go as planned, a replacement mag tube is probably hard to come by.

The Brownells tool has about 11" handle and the tool body is about 8", so it will reach at least to middle of almost any tube. It's made for most 12 gauge tubes except Mossberg models. One of the review comments on the Brownell's tool says: Believe Brownells is probably pretty knowledgeable about this one, like they usually are. good luck, GJ

Both of those are for a specific purpose on Remington shotguns and likely wouldn’t work on a tube with a dent 4-6” down the tube.

Yep, Brownells also has a tool that is the same design, if you want one pre-built for your own. Mag tube dent raiser Pretty pricey, though. A guy with a lathe could turn one real quick. And this one is pretty reasonable and claims it protects from over-expanding the mag tube. From Defender Tactical. Defender Tactical dent removal tool good luck, GJ

In that case, you must not know any custom 1911 smiths used by any serious competitive shooter, because I can give you a laundry list of people who do so, and literally everyone who is winning (and probably everyone within the top 10-20) the Open/Limited/Limited Optics/Limited 10 nationals is using a gun with a 2 pound or less trigger from one of those people. In IDPA, the winners in the Carry Optics and ESP divisions are doing the same. Unless your "action" sport is something besides USPSA, IPSC, Steel Challenge, IDPA, and maybe some I'm forgetting, literally everyone who is winning is shooting something you didn't know existed until you made these posts in this thread. And many are using 15 pound mainsprings because they want the absolute lightest trigger, and the only way to get that is with perfect sear geometry, the right sear spring tuning, and the lightest mainspring their primers will tolerate. Maybe it was different 50 years ago or something, but these sports are incredibly competitive, and the winners will do anything to win, including using trigger pulls lighter than the gun that is in their hand, among other minor equipment advantages to have every competitive edge. And there is nothing wrong with that, as if the guns are kept clean, a 2 pound trigger is absolutely reliable in a 19/2011, it just needs to be in the hand of someone responsible enough to keep it that way.

And for future reference, all Model 12s are takedown. Even the Model 12 Featherweights are takedown. They only hold 4 rounds. The Model 12 “solid frame” is called the Model 25.

Both very highly polished and used very gently. The round mandrel is a very snug fit inside the mag tube.

Send it to Boggus or Kingsnake to fix it ST

Yep, just took it apart and found a very small dent and a slight ridge on the inside. looks like a weld repair. Any pictures of those tools? i need something long enough to reach down into that tube to grind out the ridge.

Probably a dented tube. I see it often. I have a mandrel and a body hammer that I use to fix that problem.

I just bought a 1950 Winchester model 12 takedown in 12 gauge for Wild Bunch. 6 of my snap caps fit in the tube, but when I put the 6th one in, I feel the follower get stuck, or at least it gets stuck when I cycle the action quickly. It’s fine when I only put 5 in the tube. Any advice is appreciated! Thanks!

i know of none of the custom 1911 smiths who will tune a gun to a 2# trigger pull. Especially for use in an action sport (rather than a bullseye gun). GJ

The hammer's pressure on the sear is created by the mainspring. The friction between the sear and hammer is a function of a small amount of pressure from the sear spring and much more pressure from the hammer hooks on the sear. Lowering the energy stored in the mainspring absolutely reduces the amount of force it takes to trip the sear, as it's simple physics, less force from the mainspring = less friction, all else equal. You can observe this by installing a lighter mainspring in your gun and testing the trigger pull with a simple scale, which will confirm what I'm saying here for absolute certain. You will observe a lighter trigger pull with a lighter mainspring every time. Also, your claims about the underlying physics are not correct. The force on those surfaces is not only the sear spring, as the force of them mainspring, pushing up through the hammer strut to the hammer, supplies additional force between the sear and the hammer hooks. The sear spring is not the only source of force for that friction, in fact, it's minor compared to the comparatively massive energy stored in the mainspring. I don't know what a "trigger saddle" is either, but if you're talking about the trigger bow, the leaf of the sear spring that holds the sear has nothing really to do with that; the disconnector leg pushes the trigger bow forward when the shooter releases the trigger. Your claim about the hammer not moving when the trigger is pulled is also partially true, that depends on the sear/hammer relationship, and depending on the angle they meet, the trigger absolutely can move the trigger rearward when the trigger is pulled. Obviously that is not an ideal hammer and sear relationship, but depending on the angle of the hammer/sear junction, the sear can push the hammer backward further when the trigger is pulled if that angle is not cut correctly. 3.5 pounds is also about double what serious competitors are using. If a lighter trigger than that is desired, trigger pulls under 2 pounds are easily achieved, assuming the parts are fit correctly. I consider 3.5 pounds to be pretty heavy for a gun used in competition; the gun I shot two matches with last weekend is a 2.5 and many people prefer them lighter than that.

Nope. Not "certain" at all. With a proper sear to hammer cock notch fit, the 1911 hammer does not move any appreciable amount as the trigger is pulled. If the hammer does not move back, the mainspring does not compress any farther. Therefore, no compression of the mainspring means no extra force is applied to the trigger during trigger pull by the mainspring. Just the force which is applied to the trigger by the leaf of the sear spring which is resting against the trigger saddle. Browning really knew what he was doing when he designed the 1911. It allows the 1911 trigger to be tuned to 3.5 pounds of pull - and that is needed mainly to prevent the gun from doubling or firing when dropped. The 1911 pistol is a single-action design. Pulling the trigger does not cock the hammer. The hammer is cocked by the slide moving backwards during firing or racking a round in from a new magazine. Badly tuned hammers/sears that have a lot of positive angle to the full-cock-notch engagement WILL have a trigger pull that stacks (increases) as the trigger is pulled, and THAT stacking does get worse and more detectable with a real strong mainspring. But, a REAL strong mainspring is not needed for our 150 power factor loads anyway - most guns are well behaved with a mainspring at about 19 pounds of spring weight. And a recoil spring at about 15 pounds. good luck, GJ

Our new website is up and running. www.memphisgunslingers.org

I doubt you'll have problems loading Titewad that light. A friend of mine loads for his 8 year old Buckaroo son, his loads are something like 9 grains of WST with 3/4 oz of shot and the pink wad. They are crazy light and will knock down the popper if he kid gets a good hit. 11-12 grains of Titewad will almost certainly do the job if you want light. They might even be lighter than 1000 fps. If your current loads are 1100, a grain lighter than that will probably achieve what you're looking for, 2 grains almost certainly so. Certainly there is a modest change in trigger pull from a lighter mainspring in a 1911 and that would generally translate to other guns. It's far less than changing the geometry of the sear/hammer relationship, but lighter springs for a lighter trigger pull are par for the course for almost any gun. The key when I do it is to go no lighter than 100% reliability allows for. Outside of CAS/WBAS, I don't like guns addicted to federal primers, so I don't run the lightest possible springs for guns that aren't manually operated like we use in these games.