What’s the Call. . . .

[JJ]

Before this gets too far down the list, something happened at a State WB Match to that I have never heard of or have seen before.

I am one of the two posse marshals at this match. It is WARM here. There are 24 people shooting this match. The posses are lumped together shooting in one wave over the 5 stages with a A and B team in the berm. There are only two WB Trained officials at this match. One of us has a Black Pin and is the club, to which we belong, TG. For my own self, I have 7 of those little 45 pins that I have been able to accumulate over a number of years. Both of us have shot at many, many matches at multiple locations in multiple states.

The question as I understand (and saw) the circumstances is as follows. I was the posse marshal of the person shooting this string to which this happened.

I was sitting at my cart, talking to the RO Instructor about something. At the right time, I happened to look up at the unloading table and saw an individual standing there. He brought his pistol up, pointed it at the berm, squeezed the trigger and shot a round from his 1911 into the berm. Needles to say, this caused quite a ruckus. 

As we high-tailed over to the unloading table to find out what was going on, this is what we were told. The shooter have a jam in his 1911 that he could NOT clear on the line and declared a ‘dead’ gun. The gun was brought to the unloading table and after attempting to clear the gun he was able to get the round into the 1911 chamber. The shooter stated he could not eject the round by pulling back the slide. Apparently his solution to clear the round was to pull back the hammer, pull the trigger and fire the 1911 to get the round out of the chamber. The round did eject properly from the 1911 after the trigger was pulled and the round fired into the berm. Apparently no one knows who told him to clear the 1911 in this manner. If anybody did know, they certainly weren’t talking. 

Mind you there were 24 shooters in this berm. There were a number of shooters standing around the unloading table, there were shooters on the line, were counters and there were other shooters standing around just watching the match. In other words there were shooters everywhere in this bay all standing to the left, right and behind where the shooter was when he pulled the trigger and fired into the berm.

Now anybody reading this short synopsis knows as much as I do. 

Myself and the WB Instructor did not know what a call should be or if there was to be a call concerning this incident. 

I know what the call was by the match director. This person has not had any WB formal training. Let me be the first to say this, she is doing as good of a job being a match director as anyone could. 

If this incident would have happened to you at a match where you looked at as being on of the two ‘match officials’, what would you have done or called??

J.J.

[Garrison Joe]

Firearm discharge at the unloading table - rules say Match DQ:

Under the Match Disqualification section, page 29 of WB Shooters Handbook:

Quote

Any discharge at the loading or unloading areas.

The only possible reprieve would be if the shooter had asked for a match official to assist with clearing the pistol, and they found that the only possible way to clear the gun would be to cautiously BLOCK or lower the hammer, take the pistol to the firing line, and fire it safely downrange with the rest of the posse safely behind the firing line.  Then that becomes a supervised firing of the gun downrange, and no penalty is incurred. 

It is a major failure to attempt to clear a firearm at the unloading table if there is any chance it may discharge.  There should never be an idea in the mind of a shooter that cocking and firing any gun at the unloading table is a safe thing to do.

And, importantly, I have never seen a case where a well trained range official cannot get the firearm unloaded without it firing.  And if there was any possibility of it firing, I would have insisted they do THAT at the firing line with safe downrange conditions.

There is NEVER such a level of time or peer pressure at a match that the shooter should consider endangering themself or other shooters or spectators.

good luck, GJ

Edited October 1 by Garrison Joe

[JJ]

After reading a little more into this subject, I now know that the answer is. 

Garrison Joe above alludes to the answer.

Simple answer to the synopsis above is this:

The SASS Range Officers, WBAS Basic Safety Course, Pocket RO Card States under the MDQ Section:

Discharge impacting 5 feet from the shooter, while on the firing line or any discharge away from the firing line. Any discharge in the loading or loading or unloading areas.

The last sentence in the statement clearly states what the call should have been. A MDQ. 

Thinking I need to attend a few more WB RO Instruction classes. 

J.J. 

[Garrison Joe]

No, as a matter of clarification, I did not allude to an answer.  I provided the exact spot where the rules state the error and the penalty. 

The Pocket RO Card is part of the rule book, yes, but it has historically never been the main reference for the rule and penalty.  It often lags behind being correctly updated when the rules are changed.  It often paraphrases the rule and may be written in shorter form. The RO committee writes/approves the rules, they normally (from my understanding) do not compile the changes to the RO pocket card (an admin function after the rules are approved).

good luck, GJ

[Garrison Joe]

1 hour ago, JJ said:

Myself and the WB Instructor did not know what a call should be

That's disappointing, IMHO.   But glad you are seeking better understanding of the rules. GJ

[JJ]

Garrison Joe -

You were correct about my poor choice of words. You did not allude to anything. You provided, what I believe to be, was a distinct and correct answer. 

I can only apologize to you for my poor choice or words.

J.J.

PS - I really enjoy your answers to everything you provide on the SASS WB and Cowboy wires. Only wish I could get the opportunity to know you on a personal level. 

I believe you are one of the many great resources on these wires.

 

[Garrison Joe]

BTW, every WB (and Cowboy) match needs access to a squib rod to assist the shooter with clearing stuck rounds or squibbed bullets!  Lengths suitable for pistol clearing and rifle clearing.   And a squib rod or drop weight to test for and remove wads stuck in shotgun barrels.

Using one in this case would have been a correct way to get a round that the extractor cannot grab out of the chamber by running the rod from muzzle to chamber.  Stick a small rag over the slide face and extractor to make sure the primer of the round does not contact the extractor tip when the cartridge is bumped out of the chamber.

Why?  Isn't this just a crutch for an ill-prepared shooter?

No, it's because a loaded firearm may not be taken from the unloading table (which is the final "station" on the firing line of every stage) until it is cleared, except with direct supervision by a match official.

Quote

If a competitor has a firearm malfunction that cannot be cleared during the course of fire, the shooter may not leave the firing line until the firearm has been cleared. A Match Disqualification penalty will be assessed to the shooter if they leave the firing line with the malfunctioning firearm unless under the direct supervision of a Match official.

Without a suitable tool to assist a shooter or a match official to clear the stuck round, one of the match officials must find a way to assist the shooter to place that still-loaded firearm into safe condition for temporary storage and transport - maybe even over the public road system.  Make it easy to do so - keep clearing rods around the match.

good luck, GJ

Edited October 4 by Garrison Joe

[Flying W Ramrod]

However, unless a designated, safe work area, is established, the ULT could be considered that area.

Since the firearm was a declared malfunction, I don't believe the penalty for firing into the berm holds.

IMHO

[Garrison Joe]

It's just as dangerous as if NOT declared a malfunction.  There should be no "free pass" here when a potentially mortal or serious injury could result. IMHO. 

The rules establish the stage firing line with a 170 degree downrange direction required to be able to fire any of our firearms.   That eliminates most loading and unloading tables right there as being places where a gun can be fired for any reason, and maybe as a last resort, to clear it.

This gun was declared malfunctioning.  But for the shooter themselves to go ahead and try to fire that malfunctioned gun, without range safety officers attending?  And without successfully determining what caused the malfunction?  That is, generally, insanity.   It's trusting to hope instead of finding and being sure the problem with the gun has been corrected.  Did declaring the gun malfunctioned mean the gun would not fire?   Not in this case!

This particular case sounds to be an INTENTIONAL firing.   Not an accident while trying to empty the gun and somehow getting an unintended firing because of lack of knowledge, lack of care, or a mechanical problem, all of which should have been avoided by an experienced range safety officer taking charge of the malfunction.

good luck, GJ

Edited October 5 by Garrison Joe

[Garrison Joe]

Declaration of a gun malfunction should mean there should be greatly increased attention be paid to the gun and the shooter's attempt to unload it.  Not the range safety officers (perhaps including the unloading table officer at the time) ignoring the shooter's situation and leaving it to him to make a really bad safety move.

"Malfunction" is called on the line to relieve the shooter of having to try to clear the gun on the clock to be able to continue.  Shooter can even declare that themself.  Also, it alerts the line workers that the gun needs special attention to get it to the unloading table safely, without the shooter carrying it, worrying about it, perhaps even trying to jiggle the action.   And, of course, it relieves the shooter from the penalty of restaging a gun that is in an unsafe condition for normal restaging (loaded or cocked hammer on live round), so that they can continue shooting the rest of the stage.

Then at the unloading table, it needs special attention to note what failure condition and how many unfired rounds are in the gun, and then attention to returning the gun to good function safely. Nothing in that awards a free pass to commit  unsafe acts with that gun.  Unsafe acts with a still loaded gun just magnifies the safety risks.  Declaring a Malfunction is not a penalty, it's a notice to the posse that the shooter will not be trying to fix a problem with the gun on the clock.

good luck, GJ

Edited October 6 by Garrison Joe

[Burt Blade]

Easy set of inexpensive squib rods:

From most any "home improvement" or decent hardware store, obtain two ~34" pieces of aluminum rod, 1/4" and 3/8" diameter, and a 2-pound hammer.

Cut each rod at 25" / 9". File off the sharp edges of the ends.

You now have pistol/rifle/shotgun squib rods for most calibers and common barrel lengths used in WBAS and CAS. The 2-pound hammer makes it easy to tap out a stuck slug with firm force yet plenty of control.

The rod sets can be stored in a section of pvc pipe, with one end cap glued on and another pressed on.

I keep a set in my cart, and it gets used often.

The rods are cheap enough to be considered an expendable item, versus wrecking someone's cleaning rod.